Marketing best practices are actually holding back businesses from having the impact and relationship with potential clients, since it is usually about YOU, YOU, YOU … when you clients want to talk about ME, ME, ME.

Using the Hero Method developed by our special guests Kathryn Gillett, allows you to make your potential client the HERO in your #marketing and places them and their experience at the center of your marketing. It also follows the classic hero story arch, which almost every movie and book are based on. Why? Because we all love a good #story, especially if it is about us.

Learn how to create much more effective marketing when you use the Hero Method when you listen to this #fireandeartpodcast episode.

Listen in at:

Download Kathryn’s free e-book to get you started on creating the Hero Method in your marketing at:


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kathygruver: Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of the fire and earth Podcast. I am your co host Kathy Gruber.

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Jason Mefford: And I’m Jason Medford, and today we have Catherine Gillette with us and we’re so excited to get into our conversation today. So welcome, Catherine

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Kathryn Gillett: Phase is really great to be here.

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kathygruver: So why don’t you tell our listeners and viewers a little bit about yourself about what you do. I can’t wait because I was just on your show and

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kathygruver: Very excited

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Kathryn Gillett: So I’m the creator of hero method and what that’s all about is helping entrepreneurs find the words to talk and write about what they do in a way that is I put it gets a wow instead of Uh huh.

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Kathryn Gillett: Too much

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Kathryn Gillett: Too many times are too many entrepreneurs really have trouble talking and writing about what they do in a way that really grabs their audience’s attention and gets them.

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Kathryn Gillett: You know, leaning forward and saying, oh, that’s interesting. Tell me more which, after all, initially is all we really need to do

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Kathryn Gillett: We need them to be interested in intrigued and want to know more. And then that authentic conversation can be getting whether it’s in person or

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Kathryn Gillett: Or on the web. That’s really what we need to do so here method does that all the way from the initial introduction, all the way to loyal customer. It’s about staying connected with them in a

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Kathryn Gillett: In an authentic human to human connection, rather than, you know, marketing communication and that’s it uses the hidden powers of story to do that. So those are the kind of the unique things about the hero.

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kathygruver: I love this, especially in this day and age where we are tracking our homes. We are trapped on zoom this has become communication. This has become that relationship.

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kathygruver: And we had a guest on ages ago who talked about story and how he weaves story into the corporate conversations and things. And it was a fascinating conversation. So what is your background that got you to this point. How did you come up with this.

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Kathryn Gillett: Well,

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Kathryn Gillett: I was, I had been actually I was really inspired by Joseph Campbell’s work when he first did. I don’t know if you’re familiar with the Power of Myth interview with Bill Moyers

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Kathryn Gillett: So that that pretty much changed my life because that’s when I decided what I was going to do is follow my bliss and not do what I was supposed to do.

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Kathryn Gillett: And not do what they thought I should do and you know what my family thought I should do all of those kinds of cultural pressures.

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Kathryn Gillett: And so that’s what I’ve been doing ever since. And initially what that meant was, it was this light bulb moment. Oh, I’ll write a historical fiction novel.

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Kathryn Gillett: Because I was also an amateur historian I was the Elizabeth and historian for at the time. And so what, but my problem with historical fiction was, and still is, it tends to be long on fiction and very short on history.

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Kathryn Gillett: Yeah, and I i actually personally think it’s an ethical issue like if you’re good at it. I mean, you don’t have to be an expert but read three books on the subject, and then write your novel, you know, then

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Kathryn Gillett: Because it’s it’s your piece, people think they’re learning history, but they’re not. So that was my I was on a mission to write a historical fiction that was engaging and historically accurate. So I used I took the the dry bones of history. It’s a, it’s basically about this.

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Kathryn Gillett: Francis Drake’s circumnavigation of the globe this adventure, and went on and I used the mythic motifs of the hero’s journey mythic motifs and archetypes of the hero’s journey to be the foundation of that story.

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Kathryn Gillett: So the fictional. The only fictional character in the book is the hero who goes on this adventure. So we see this. We meet Drake and everybody and have this adventure through his eyes so that started that, and then

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Kathryn Gillett: What I was doing to pay the rent, so to speak, at the time, was I was I, I already had donkey’s years experience in marketing. So I was writing copy

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Kathryn Gillett: For for corporations at the time and doing messaging and branding work and that side of thing is it as a consultant

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Kathryn Gillett: So I’ve realized, you know, if I could bring the dry bones of history to life, using the music motifs of the hero’s journey. Maybe I could do that for my clients.

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Kathryn Gillett: My clients at the time were were tech companies and that tends to be kind of a dry subject for for many folks. And so that’s how the hero method was born.

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Kathryn Gillett: To really use that as a foundation for messaging and storytelling for companies and so yeah that was about 10 years ago that I first, you know, was kind of had that aha moment and that

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Jason Mefford: Was that’s really cool and it’s it’s only something that 100% of entrepreneurs could use right

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Jason Mefford: It’s, you know, because it because it’s

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Jason Mefford: You know, like you’d like you’re saying technology is kind of dry well for some of us actually technology is pretty cool right but

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Jason Mefford: For the, for the masses of people. It’s a very dry subject right i mean like yesterday I was talking to a guy who’s actually a coder.

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Jason Mefford: And you start talking with coders and they just go nuts about kind of the art behind it, you know, and some of the stuff like that but but to most people, something like computer code.

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Jason Mefford: is boring. Right. I love that the dry bones of history and you’re bringing it to life. That’s great imagery. I know you’re a writer.

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Jason Mefford: By using imagery like that. But it’s, you know, like you said, so many of us as entrepreneurs. It’s the same thing. We’re really excited about what we do.

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Jason Mefford: We know that it’s it’s important for people, but it’s hard to actually capture and engage people and the fact that people love stories.

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Jason Mefford: Right, so, so when you were saying the hero method at first. I’m like the hero method that’s kind of cool, then you started seeing stories. I’m like a hero story, I bet. Here it comes. Here it comes. That’s where

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Kathryn Gillett: Yes. And actually, you know, thank you. Give me. I want to just take a moment to say, yeah, I think technology is really cool to it is just again. And this is just the classic problem of it’s the way we talk about it the way

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Kathryn Gillett: And it’s anything that we do. There’s all kinds of we all of us every entrepreneur has every right to be really proud of what they do.

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Kathryn Gillett: And to that. The problem is we are so immersed in what we do, we’re bathing in all the details of what we do and they become normal we become what’s called habituation

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Kathryn Gillett: And so we just think it’s so basic and yet we’re absolute experts at it we forgotten what it’s like

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Kathryn Gillett: To have beginner’s mind to not know all these details or not even really care about all those details. And that’s really where our audience is especially when we’re first introducing them and even, you know, there’s a whole

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Kathryn Gillett: I call it the decision journey that we that hopefully we’re guiding our audience through but

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Kathryn Gillett: But very rarely do they really want to know or need to know the details that that really excite us about what we about what we have to offer. It’s really about how can we help them get from where they are to where they want to be. That’s really

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Kathryn Gillett: What our what our job is as marketers

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kathygruver: Well, and I love that you said that every profession has it’s exciting parts, that’s really how we language it. I mean, I’ve talked to, I

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kathygruver: had a conversation with a coder. Specifically, I don’t know how to code. I don’t do math. I don’t do I turn my computer on that’s as far as it goes, and I was talking about coding and I said,

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kathygruver: I just like how your brain works to put all these symbols together to get content is just stuff like that’s fascinating to me and he was quite the storyteller.

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kathygruver: And he explained to me in great detail how he does coding and it was the most fascinating thing ever. And I know I could have asked somebody else in the company where three seconds, and it would have been like, I’m so sorry. Is this question, you know.

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kathygruver: It is how we language things and how we tell stories. And I know, didn’t you, Catherine. Did you tell me you had an acting background as well.

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kathygruver: Yes.

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kathygruver: When you tell people you’re an actor. They thought that was the most exciting thing ever. They wanted to hear about it because it’s different because it’s exotic because it’s exciting. If you say I’m a coder. People are like,

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kathygruver: Oh, I wonder what that guy does, you know. So how do you take this bare bones of a company. And how do you shift that into the story to get people enthralled by it.

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Kathryn Gillett: Well, the very most important thing, the most important thing is

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Kathryn Gillett: That we need to let go of the belief and it’s reinforced all over the place and it’s in best practices marketing that we are the hero that our product is the hero that our solution is the hero, we need to let go of that because

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Kathryn Gillett: The, the correct way I would say to look at it is and the more effective way to look at it is that your audience is the hero on a quest to find the elixir that will heal their wounded land.

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Kathryn Gillett: Again, this these motifs. Right. And every, every great story every, every blockbuster movie every international best selling novel and every story across cultures and across time. There’s the hero. And there’s a mentor always the two

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Kathryn Gillett: So your audience is the hero, you are mentor. You’re, you are Obi Wan Kenobi to your audience is Luke Skywalker, who needs to learn how to use the force which is the elixir

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Kathryn Gillett: In order to end to master the force in order to make that million to one shot and make their world a better place. Right.

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Kathryn Gillett: So it’s this. Is this really important mental shift that needs to be made that when we realize we are our audiences mentor offering them helpful insight and advice at every step of their journey.

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Kathryn Gillett: All of a sudden, everything changes. And so the, what we need to tell them changes because it isn’t the story about our product.

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Kathryn Gillett: It’s this. It’s their story. I call it the story of transformation. It’s about how do we, what’s the story actually is about how we help them get from where they are from their wounded land called the wonderland.

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Kathryn Gillett: How we help them get from the wounded land to the heel land. That’s the story that’s important. It’s not the story of our product.

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Kathryn Gillett: And how it came to be an old boy right we see pages and pages of the history of the product in the about us page on websites, you know,

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Kathryn Gillett: That’s where yeah so so that’s not what’s important, what’s important, the about us page should be about that story of transformation. What we’re about is helping transform

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Kathryn Gillett: take you on a journey of transformation from again where you are to what you’re already wanting and needing and yearning for

00:11:07.050 –> 00:11:15.510
Kathryn Gillett: We understand that. And then what we can take you there. And then even beyond that because very often what your audience is wanting and needing and yearning for

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Kathryn Gillett: Is just kind of even the beginning of what we all of us have to offer. But that’s where we need to connect with them. We need to connect with them based on where they are in their journey, not where we think they need to be.

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Jason Mefford: Well, that’s where it really this kind of a story approach varies significantly from, you know, I use the word corporate marketing, right, because that’s what you know most entrepreneurs kind of

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Jason Mefford: Mimic corporate marketing, right. And usually the corporate marketing the about us page. Here’s the features and benefits of our product. This is why we’re so much better than our competition, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Right.

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Jason Mefford: And for most people. Again, it’s like, well, I really don’t give a shit about the features and benefits. I’m trying to find this elixir to heal my wounded land where is it right and it, it shifts the focus from being about us to being about the client or the customer.

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Jason Mefford: Right. It says when you’re when you’re focusing on the hero and you know you talked about. Yeah, there’s always a hero, the hero is your customer, right, there’s always the mentor.

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Jason Mefford: The Yoda. The Obi Wan Kenobi, whoever it is, right, that’s helping the hero along but there’s also some other pieces to it as well. Right. There’s got to be the villain. You’ve got to have the you know the the

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Kathryn Gillett: Shadow

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Jason Mefford: You know, yes, some some

00:12:41.160 –> 00:12:42.720
Jason Mefford: Vader Darth Vader.

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Jason Mefford: The, the, the Lord says if you know anybody there has to be that that villain in it as well. And I’m guessing as well, too, right, because we’re talking about movies every movie that is successful has

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Jason Mefford: Almost all of them have the hero’s journey as the basic storyline, but there’s ups and downs. Right. So it’s like as soon as the hero kind of comes up.

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Jason Mefford: Then they come back down again, right, because it won’t hold our attention if everything is good or everything is bad, you have to kind of mix, a lot of that stuff in and I’m guessing.

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Jason Mefford: You know, kind of from a marketing standpoint. That’s why there’s the pleasure and the pain.

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Jason Mefford: side of it that you’re talking about, as you’re going through the journey as well. Right. You’re talking about the wounded land, how much it sucks to live in a land that doesn’t produce anything

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Jason Mefford: And then you start talking about the benefits, how would it be if you could find an elixir that would, you know, heal your land and you would have bountiful harvest after that point in front of us imagery to right

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Kathryn Gillett: Yeah.

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Jason Mefford: We can kind of geek out on this right I’ve

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Jason Mefford: Already I’ve been writing down. I’m like, oh, damn. That’s good. Alliteration like that.

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kathygruver: Jason

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kathygruver: Can be talking about his bountiful

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Jason Mefford: bountiful land as I, Lord over my province.

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Jason Mefford: Oh god, anyway.

00:14:07.200 –> 00:14:07.560

00:14:14.100 –> 00:14:21.870
Jason Mefford: But, but I think that’s kind of what what you’re talking about. Right. Catherine, so I mean how would make maybe can, can you give kind of an example of

00:14:22.530 –> 00:14:31.350
Jason Mefford: We’ve talked about the theory. But how would how would a business owner and entrepreneur may be actually kind of put this into into practice for them. Right.

00:14:31.800 –> 00:14:34.740
Kathryn Gillett: Well, you know what I can do, I can actually give you an example.

00:14:34.800 –> 00:14:37.140
Kathryn Gillett: Yeah. Can I, can I actually read an example.

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kathygruver: Oh, yeah.

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Kathryn Gillett: OK, cool.

00:14:41.340 –> 00:14:46.770
Kathryn Gillett: It’s a, it’s I will come, we’re going to compare best practices marketing and hero method.

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Kathryn Gillett: Approach. Okay, so what I’m going to read first is this is a person who learned to hear method and wrote this, they own a yoga studio and they wrote them themselves, not one of these words is mine. This is all them writing it themselves.

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Kathryn Gillett: Tired of overcrowded classes that leave you feeling frustrated bored or injured. It doesn’t have to be that way.

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Kathryn Gillett: Imagine yoga, that makes you feel safe strong accomplished and relaxed, your experience begins before you get to the front door.

00:15:16.980 –> 00:15:24.180
Kathryn Gillett: You enter an oasis of palm trees, plants and a flowing fountain. You open the door and you’re greeted with welcoming smile.

00:15:24.840 –> 00:15:36.240
Kathryn Gillett: The spaces clean bright and smells pleasant you settle in, you hear your instructors voice, the rest of the world falls away you indulge in your meantime for the day.

00:15:36.930 –> 00:15:46.140
Kathryn Gillett: You enjoy the challenge of your class the personalized direction you receive is priceless. You know, you’re staying safe and you feel stronger, more confident each week.

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Kathryn Gillett: After class you re, re enter the day you knew. You’re refreshed with a sense of accomplishment and calm. Welcome to the slow body experience. We’d love for you to feel this way to give us a call 55512345 670 movie. And we’ll help you get started.

00:16:03.660 –> 00:16:04.350
Kathryn Gillett: Okay, now

00:16:04.860 –> 00:16:20.820
Kathryn Gillett: Just notice how you felt when you were taking that in. Now notice this, this isn’t actually this is not this is really pretty good copy using the best practices features advantages benefits approach. This is a different yoga studio and this is their postcard.

00:16:22.170 –> 00:16:33.870
Kathryn Gillett: Our cities yoga alliance school was born out of the passion to share wellness. We believe in the integration of your physical, mental, and spiritual health to help you achieve the optimal state of well being and balance.

00:16:34.320 –> 00:16:43.920
Kathryn Gillett: This is how we created your yoga classes and spa treatments, our cities premier yoga and spa center. We are in a waste for relaxation and rejuvenation.

00:16:44.400 –> 00:16:51.180
Kathryn Gillett: The center is a place to play explore, discover and find your balance. We are a warm environment often literally

00:16:51.480 –> 00:17:01.710
Kathryn Gillett: And feature a variety of daily classes, male and female, changing rooms with showers a fresh juice bar and a spacious classroom where you’ll find a wealth of new friends and self awareness.

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Kathryn Gillett: Which yoga studio, would you want to go to

00:17:07.680 –> 00:17:08.520
Jason Mefford: Go for first one

00:17:08.700 –> 00:17:09.120

00:17:10.140 –> 00:17:11.790
kathygruver: And I don’t like yoga, I

00:17:12.090 –> 00:17:13.590
Kathryn Gillett: Don’t want to go there.

00:17:13.920 –> 00:17:17.850
kathygruver: And I’m going to go to say they weave they they’re giving you an experience.

00:17:17.910 –> 00:17:20.610
Kathryn Gillett: Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly.

00:17:20.850 –> 00:17:26.280
kathygruver: Well, and I was gonna say, because as you were talking before you give the examples I’m thinking, you know, when I was doing massage

00:17:26.490 –> 00:17:37.920
kathygruver: It was I offer deep tissue and trigger point to help you with your sports injuries and data. So rather than talking about what I offer asked what you say what they’re going to get from it. You’re gonna walk out with your muscles relaxed in your

00:17:38.190 –> 00:17:41.790
kathygruver: Worries and cares swept away and you know so it’s like, oh, okay.

00:17:43.110 –> 00:17:53.100
Jason Mefford: Well, and, and, and as you were reading it to. I was noticing how many times the second one. Use the word oui oui oui oui oui oui.

00:17:54.000 –> 00:18:10.620
Jason Mefford: Oui oui oui. You know, I noticed one you in there. Yes, whereas in the first one. It really was. It was talking about you and taking the person literally on a journey using the words so that they could see, hear and feel right because

00:18:10.680 –> 00:18:12.660
Jason Mefford: Yes, focusing on the

00:18:14.310 –> 00:18:15.120
Jason Mefford: The senses.

00:18:15.180 –> 00:18:16.350
Kathryn Gillett: As well, yes.

00:18:16.680 –> 00:18:27.330
Jason Mefford: You can actually envision yourself walking into the yoga studio versus the other one where it’s just kind of talking at you.

00:18:27.690 –> 00:18:36.000
Kathryn Gillett: Right. Exactly. Exactly. So this is a, there’s a lot of Neurology in in the background of the hero method as well.

00:18:36.570 –> 00:18:44.070
Kathryn Gillett: And so this is actually called. It’s one of the most powerful things. And this is one of the things your listeners can take away this is one of the most powerful things you can do.

00:18:44.550 –> 00:18:54.480
Kathryn Gillett: To I like to say inspire rather than persuade and heaven forbid, don’t even go into manipulation, but to inspire your audience. There’s a called mental simulations.

00:18:55.320 –> 00:19:07.620
Kathryn Gillett: And so what what urologist know is that when you were when you were when I tell a story when you were listening to that neurons were firing in your head as if it was happening to you.

00:19:08.760 –> 00:19:18.270
Kathryn Gillett: It literally is the experiences being stimulated and when we have this you trust me months from now, you’re going to remember this postcard copy

00:19:18.630 –> 00:19:25.710
Kathryn Gillett: Yeah, because you’ve had the experience when we had the experience is not just reading and words coming in and it you know going out.

00:19:26.070 –> 00:19:38.520
Kathryn Gillett: It’s actually an experience and we have that experience. It’s incredibly powerful. That’s probably the most powerful thing we can do is create an experience with our content not share information right

00:19:38.730 –> 00:19:49.950
kathygruver: Well, and then the other thing that inspires a business owner to do is make sure they actually give you that experience because like, you know, if you show up and there’s no palm trees with a trash can. And there’s a homeless guy. And there’s puking.

00:19:51.090 –> 00:19:51.990
kathygruver: And then the receptionist.

00:19:56.100 –> 00:19:56.730
Was so wrong.

00:20:00.270 –> 00:20:02.310
kathygruver: Your yoga class. Yeah, she’s smoking and there’s

00:20:04.860 –> 00:20:06.720
Jason Mefford: Like the mom from throw momma from the training.

00:20:16.260 –> 00:20:17.820
kathygruver: Flow turn to see what in the world.

00:20:19.920 –> 00:20:22.500
kathygruver: I mean it’s keeping you accountable for

00:20:23.700 –> 00:20:39.150
kathygruver: Giving them a good experience and making sure that you’re living up to that journey. After the marketing because yeah you get them in the studio and then they go, that’s not right. So that’s, that’s fabulous. It’s, it’s going past the marketing them.

00:20:39.870 –> 00:20:48.750
Kathryn Gillett: Absolutely. Well, this is, this is one of the aspects of it is that it brings up the question, what is the elixir. I mean, there’s actually here’s the details of the elixir yeah

00:20:48.780 –> 00:20:54.840
Kathryn Gillett: And so the elixir is, you know, is it you know you know somebody’s basement.

00:20:56.490 –> 00:21:05.220
Kathryn Gillett: You know, next to a garbage dump, or is it this, you know, have we created this you know really lovely peaceful place. What’s the, what is the elixir yeah

00:21:05.700 –> 00:21:07.590
kathygruver: And you’re for a yoga studio now.

00:21:09.510 –> 00:21:10.560
Kathryn Gillett: Basement near garbage.

00:21:12.690 –> 00:21:13.710
kathygruver: Trash yoga.

00:21:17.040 –> 00:21:19.200
Jason Mefford: Are you tired of those ice places this smell.

00:21:20.250 –> 00:21:20.970
kathygruver: We call it hot.

00:21:21.180 –> 00:21:22.470
kathygruver: It’s hot and stinky.

00:21:23.190 –> 00:21:23.730

00:21:25.530 –> 00:21:26.550
Kathryn Gillett: stinky yoga. Yeah.

00:21:26.700 –> 00:21:27.240
Kathryn Gillett: Very good.

00:21:27.450 –> 00:21:29.760
Kathryn Gillett: And only in the summer in like New York

00:21:29.940 –> 00:21:30.360
Kathryn Gillett: You know,

00:21:32.490 –> 00:21:33.510
Jason Mefford: Everything to. Yeah.

00:21:33.660 –> 00:21:35.250
kathygruver: It’s like go yoga, but we use rats.

00:21:35.610 –> 00:21:37.620
Kathryn Gillett: Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

00:21:38.070 –> 00:21:40.620
Jason Mefford: Well, and it’s it’s funny because to as we were talking, you know,

00:21:40.650 –> 00:21:47.100
Jason Mefford: I mean, at the beginning, we talked about. I mean, you used to write for Britannica right and and the whole historical fiction stuff.

00:21:47.580 –> 00:21:58.080
Jason Mefford: You know whether again that’s that’s that’s book or if it’s if it’s, you know, there’s a lot of historical fiction ish shows and movies and other things like that as well.

00:21:58.470 –> 00:22:06.360
Jason Mefford: And you know why people are. I was one of those nerds that actually read the encyclopedias. You know, when I was a kid, you were too. Yeah, I know.

00:22:06.810 –> 00:22:26.940
Jason Mefford: But, but so many people you know they do get their history lesson by reading historical novels by watching these movies or tv series about historical events because it’s a more enjoyable way to for people usually to be able to consume and get the information

00:22:27.270 –> 00:22:27.570
Kathryn Gillett: Right.

00:22:28.140 –> 00:22:36.300
Jason Mefford: And so just the same thing, you know it’s it’s a much more enjoyable way for them to read one of these, you know, hero method.

00:22:38.490 –> 00:22:44.640
Jason Mefford: Advertisements the wrong word, but marketing piece right much more enjoyable for them.

00:22:45.210 –> 00:22:57.600
Jason Mefford: To do that, it’s that experiential that you’re talking about. And again, if they feel good after going through that experience. I’m guessing they’re going to feel good towards your whatever it is that you’re selling as well. Right.

00:22:58.080 –> 00:23:01.290
Kathryn Gillett: Absolutely. That’s a really, really, really good point. Jason because

00:23:02.610 –> 00:23:06.420
Kathryn Gillett: Basically the summary of the point I’m going to make is everybody’s an emotional bond.

00:23:06.990 –> 00:23:16.080
Kathryn Gillett: Yeah, we are not rational decision makers, we really aren’t human beings just simply aren’t there’s no research that shows we make decisions based on you know logic.

00:23:16.740 –> 00:23:23.100
Kathryn Gillett: It is about how do we feel about this product. How do we feel this is why people stand in line.

00:23:23.580 –> 00:23:30.840
Kathryn Gillett: To go read, you know, if that if there was another Harry Potter book coming out, man. People would line up around the block right

00:23:31.470 –> 00:23:39.570
Kathryn Gillett: Same thing with a, you know, no, no. The latest Star Wars. Right. It’s just like people lined up around the block to go see that again and again.

00:23:39.990 –> 00:23:42.960
Kathryn Gillett: And and this is all because of how they feel about it.

00:23:43.320 –> 00:23:57.720
Kathryn Gillett: And also because oh by the way those stories and are also very much the hero’s journey story is very much based on that. Yeah. So we are, but it’s the emotional. It’s the emotional connection to the gadget, you know, the next Apple thing, right.

00:23:58.170 –> 00:24:10.500
Kathryn Gillett: At you know people line up because there’s an emotional connection to the company that that Apple is very carefully developed that emotional relationship with their with their audience.

00:24:12.120 –> 00:24:14.550
Jason Mefford: And I think what you said you know that Emotional. Emotional

00:24:15.720 –> 00:24:27.840
Jason Mefford: Everybody is an emotional by that’s an important thing that people need to get through their head because I’ve actually done. There’s a lot of empirical evidence actual scientific research prove that point as well.

00:24:29.130 –> 00:24:30.270
Jason Mefford: That you know

00:24:31.620 –> 00:24:34.890
Jason Mefford: Six to seven seconds before we actually consciously make a decision.

00:24:35.400 –> 00:24:42.870
Jason Mefford: It’s already gone off in the back of our brain in our subconscious. Yeah. And there’s been several studies that kind of back that up that it’s always

00:24:43.170 –> 00:25:01.140
Jason Mefford: It’s an emotion that causes us to make a decision and we make the decision subconsciously before we ever even recognize it consciously. So the more than your emotion into it, right, the better because because people are going to use emotion to make decisions. Yeah.

00:25:01.230 –> 00:25:15.270
Kathryn Gillett: Absolutely. And then, then, then I think the thing that makes us believe that we’re rational is what happens. It’s called confirmation bias. So what we’ll do is we’ll find the facts to support the emotional decision and it will say, Oh, I just made a very smart choice because

00:25:15.330 –> 00:25:16.320
Kathryn Gillett: You know, this isn’t this

00:25:16.920 –> 00:25:26.970
Kathryn Gillett: But so if you know our own brain fools us into thinking what a good boy am I, and I’m so rational and I’m so smart, but actually it was an emotional decision. Yeah, yeah.

00:25:27.540 –> 00:25:36.840
kathygruver: I’ve had people come up to me after my talk. So I set out all my books, and they go, this was the greatest talk. I want one of every book. I’m not going to read them, but I have to have them. I’m like,

00:25:37.260 –> 00:25:37.680

00:25:38.820 –> 00:25:41.220
kathygruver: I’m not gonna be like, no. Now, you said you weren’t

00:25:41.220 –> 00:25:49.680
kathygruver: Gonna read them. So I don’t want to make that set, you know, but it’s true. People get excited about. I’ve done that to your mind you get signed by the author, then you get home, you go

00:25:52.920 –> 00:26:04.020
kathygruver: To the stack of books to hold my computer up high enough, you know, um, so I know Catherine people can work with you individually. I also know you have an amazing book. So tell us about the amazing book.

00:26:04.830 –> 00:26:16.080
Kathryn Gillett: So the amazing book is available on Amazon and just go and search out the hero method and they’ve got two versions ones for tech companies and ones for small businesses.

00:26:17.790 –> 00:26:24.360
Kathryn Gillett: And yeah, and if you’re a prime member, you can get the Kindle version free so that’s that’s a cool deal

00:26:25.980 –> 00:26:26.820
Kathryn Gillett: And

00:26:30.270 –> 00:26:35.310
Kathryn Gillett: Oh yeah, oh yeah, I knew what I want to say. So the yoga postcard that we liked.

00:26:35.370 –> 00:26:35.610
kathygruver: Yeah.

00:26:35.910 –> 00:26:40.650
Kathryn Gillett: That was written by somebody who read the book, never worked with me personally, she

00:26:41.010 –> 00:26:42.030
Jason Mefford: walked in and she did it.

00:26:42.510 –> 00:26:48.630
Kathryn Gillett: Yeah, so that’s how effective the book is it’ll actually teach you how to write content like that.

00:26:48.900 –> 00:26:55.140
Jason Mefford: Well, and I think it’s an important thing to write for for everybody because I’m an Amazon Prime member. So I’m gonna go download it to right. Hey,

00:26:55.410 –> 00:26:55.740
Kathryn Gillett: You know,

00:26:55.770 –> 00:26:59.640
Jason Mefford: Wish I could give you a few dollars for it. So some of your PayPal account or something.

00:27:02.460 –> 00:27:13.020
Jason Mefford: The point is the reason that yoga studio owner got value from the book is here. She actually sat down.

00:27:13.500 –> 00:27:22.710
Jason Mefford: And implemented what you were telling him right so so that’s an important thing we can read all the books that we want to, but if you don’t actually take action.

00:27:23.280 –> 00:27:28.590
Jason Mefford: And and try to do it, try to incorporate what you’re learning into what you’re doing.

00:27:29.010 –> 00:27:42.960
Jason Mefford: Then you know it’s it’s as good as all those books that we buy and have the author sign and they just sit on the shelf or hold up our computer so you have actually got a, you know, Kathy was giving you good stuff. Folks, now you got to actually go out and try to start implementing it.

00:27:43.410 –> 00:27:47.040
kathygruver: Well, unlike anything. It’s like you can join the gym, you still have to go. You can sign up for

00:27:48.060 –> 00:27:52.950
kathygruver: Some dating service, you still have to swipe. You know, it’s like it is about that taking action and we have

00:27:53.280 –> 00:28:06.150
kathygruver: So many phenomenal guests on where I don’t know about you, Jason, but I’ve actually put some other practices in into motion and being that I’m kind of in the midst of launching my coaching practice. I know what I’m doing. After the show is I’m getting the book.

00:28:07.230 –> 00:28:16.170
kathygruver: Because I need to make sure that my copy sounds like that journey. That sounds like that that that story because that’s who I am. Anyway, so

00:28:16.650 –> 00:28:24.210
Kathryn Gillett: Kathy. I think it’s, yeah, it’s a really, really good fit for you that natural fit for you, I think, to the other thing I just want to say is

00:28:24.720 –> 00:28:30.660
Kathryn Gillett: That a lot of people, a lot of entrepreneurs procrastinate about marketing because I I do feel

00:28:30.960 –> 00:28:45.180
Kathryn Gillett: That, you know, you just it just feels uncomfortable and achy like putting ourselves as a hero doesn’t feel right. And what I’ve found in working with with entrepreneurs is when you switch that role and now your mentor.

00:28:45.660 –> 00:28:55.110
Kathryn Gillett: And now you’re writing from that point of view it now all of a sudden the writing is flowing because it actually feels like a true and natural relationship now.

00:28:55.590 –> 00:29:00.690
Kathryn Gillett: With the audience, rather than saying, hey, look at me, I’m so great. It’s like, hey, look at you.

00:29:01.170 –> 00:29:06.750
Kathryn Gillett: On your journey. Are you. Great. And here’s like these way that I can help you. You know, the next step. And the next step.

00:29:07.260 –> 00:29:18.480
Kathryn Gillett: So it changes the relationship. So it changes the way you feel about doing marketing and about writing marketing and I’d like to, if I can. I’d like to offer your audience a gift as well.

00:29:18.690 –> 00:29:20.550
Kathryn Gillett: Yes, we love gifts.

00:29:20.730 –> 00:29:28.470
Kathryn Gillett: And it actually, it ties into I’ve got a little visual here, it ties into what we’re just talking about, it’s the, it’s called the decision journey. Can you see this

00:29:29.130 –> 00:29:38.970
Kathryn Gillett: Working there. So this is the wounded land and this is the quest. And this is the elixir and this is the mastery and that’s the heel. Then, so this is their journey briefly.

00:29:39.570 –> 00:29:48.660
Kathryn Gillett: And so this is the hero’s journey. Their, their decisions during this is you his mentor over here. And so what I’ve, I’ve created an E book.

00:29:49.140 –> 00:29:56.130
Kathryn Gillett: That would love to share with your audience and it basically takes you through this to create the marketing framework that will actually

00:29:56.520 –> 00:30:06.900
Kathryn Gillett: Reach out the, what are you going to do to reach out to your audience and guide them through their quest into mastering your Elixir and becoming long term loyal customers. So it’s

00:30:07.170 –> 00:30:15.420
Kathryn Gillett: It’s a book, they’ll take them step by step. They’re actually creating it. I call it it’s maybe your sales funnel, but it’s their decision journey.

00:30:15.870 –> 00:30:34.260
Kathryn Gillett: So it’s about how to create a marketing plan a marketing framework that will guide your audience through their decision journey. So all they have to do is go to www dot the hero method calm, forward slash decision journey and they can get that gift.

00:30:35.790 –> 00:30:38.610
Jason Mefford: It was the hero method calm, forward slash

00:30:39.180 –> 00:30:40.260
Kathryn Gillett: Decision journey.

00:30:40.500 –> 00:30:41.640
Jason Mefford: Decision journey.

00:30:41.730 –> 00:30:42.570
Kathryn Gillett: One word. Yeah.

00:30:43.110 –> 00:30:43.500
Jason Mefford: All right.

00:30:43.920 –> 00:30:49.590
kathygruver: We’ll have that in the show notes. And I’ll have a little if everyone’s watching it’ll go across the bottom of this.

00:30:50.400 –> 00:30:51.630
kathygruver: Wonderful. Yeah.

00:30:52.020 –> 00:30:53.460
kathygruver: So great, Jason, you have a thought.

00:30:53.970 –> 00:31:03.780
Jason Mefford: Well, I was just, you know, just because I know we’re kind of wrapping up on time, too. But it’s, it’s, um, you know, I like what you said there at the end because so many business owners don’t mark it.

00:31:04.470 –> 00:31:12.780
Jason Mefford: Because they feel icky about it right and and so so that that whole idea that you were just saying of switching it from

00:31:13.380 –> 00:31:31.380
Jason Mefford: Us. Oh, you know, are we to the hero’s journey takes a lot of the ickiness out of it and and the reality as I mean one of my mentors just hits this home all the time. He’s like, you know, you’re, you’re, if you’re an entrepreneur, your primary job is marketing.

00:31:32.490 –> 00:31:36.720
Jason Mefford: And if you don’t market, then you just have a hobby. You don’t have a business.

00:31:37.380 –> 00:31:50.220
Jason Mefford: And so for a lot of people that are, you know, struggling as entrepreneurs, it’s because they’re not marketing and if they’re not marketing because they feel icky about marketing then try something like the hero method.

00:31:50.580 –> 00:31:55.950
Jason Mefford: Where you don’t have to feel icky about it. What you’re providing is that elixir to people.

00:31:56.310 –> 00:32:12.090
Jason Mefford: And people are looking for that because they do have the wounded land that needs to be healed. Right. And so if what you have can help them you’re actually doing them a disservice by not telling them the elixir exists right

00:32:12.540 –> 00:32:26.340
Kathryn Gillett: Absolutely, absolutely. And the other thing about this. It’s really interesting. And it’s been proven over and over again and really measurable is when you actually use the hearing that you can see it in that example you use the hero method and you don’t have to sell.

00:32:26.850 –> 00:32:31.140
Kathryn Gillett: Yeah, people just, you know, people, you just going to go to that yoga studio

00:32:32.010 –> 00:32:37.050
Kathryn Gillett: People just going to start showing up and over and over that people will write their web content and all of a sudden

00:32:37.260 –> 00:32:42.870
Kathryn Gillett: This website that used to just kind of sit in the ether of getting crickets, people are calling them now.

00:32:43.110 –> 00:32:54.450
Kathryn Gillett: Because of what they’ve read on the website. So it actually does a lot of the selling for you because you’re creating that authentic connection. You’re creating that emotional connection.

00:32:54.780 –> 00:33:00.690
Kathryn Gillett: You’re helping them feel good, even, you know, whatever that was that emotion, you’re feeling good when you were reading that

00:33:01.230 –> 00:33:10.680
Kathryn Gillett: And that’s that positive emotion that people. Okay, at least, even if it’s a more complicated sell. It’s okay. Tell me more. And now you just keep giving them that

00:33:11.070 –> 00:33:17.610
Kathryn Gillett: positive emotional authentic human to human connection and they’ll just want to do business with you. It’ll just works that way.

00:33:18.120 –> 00:33:21.900
kathygruver: so incredible. All right, we have once we can talk all day about this. This was so good.

00:33:22.350 –> 00:33:22.860
Jason Mefford: Our guests.

00:33:22.890 –> 00:33:29.520
kathygruver: Catherine has been amazing. Catherine wants to tell everybody where to reach you. I know that you mentioned the website already, but let’s tell everybody again.

00:33:30.330 –> 00:33:38.700
Kathryn Gillett: So it’s the hero method calm. You can reach me there or info at the hero method calm is my email.

00:33:40.290 –> 00:33:51.900
Kathryn Gillett: And yeah, so you can go to the website, you can go get the book at Amazon, the hero method at Amazon and those are different ways to or the hero method calm, forward slash decision journey.

00:33:52.230 –> 00:33:57.660
Kathryn Gillett: And there’s a bunch of different options about how you can lean in and learn more about the here.

00:33:58.500 –> 00:34:02.520
Jason Mefford: Well, I know. So Kathy was on your podcast, too. So you have a podcast as well to right

00:34:03.060 –> 00:34:04.770
Kathryn Gillett: No I don’t, I don’t, you know,

00:34:05.100 –> 00:34:08.580
kathygruver: I realized as I was saying that we had such an awesome conversation. I could remember

00:34:09.750 –> 00:34:10.980
Kathryn Gillett: If you didn’t, we’re okay right because

00:34:10.980 –> 00:34:13.860
Jason Mefford: I was like, no, if you’ve got a podcast we want to get that on here to okay

00:34:14.220 –> 00:34:16.830
Kathryn Gillett: Thank you know we just had a really awesome conversation.

00:34:19.110 –> 00:34:21.240
Kathryn Gillett: That went for quite a while but yeah yeah

00:34:21.240 –> 00:34:22.050
kathygruver: So I suddenly had this

00:34:22.590 –> 00:34:24.450
kathygruver: Show it should have been a show. It was a really good

00:34:24.480 –> 00:34:25.950
Kathryn Gillett: It should have been. It was it was a

00:34:25.950 –> 00:34:26.820
kathygruver: Good conversation.

00:34:28.110 –> 00:34:32.340
kathygruver: Anyway, all right, we should wrap. I am Kathy gruver I can reach a Kathy Gruber calm.

00:34:32.730 –> 00:34:44.610
Jason Mefford: And I’m Jason method I can be reached at Jason method calm, so go out everybody have a fabulous week start figuring out how you can start incorporating the hero method in your organization as well.

00:34:45.120 –> 00:34:54.690
Jason Mefford: And help those people help those people that need your help and we’ll catch you on a future episode of the fire and earth podcast. See ya. Yeah.

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